6502 адаптер 65816 за Правец8 / Apple 2 цели

[Pichaga933]

"C" е по новия и е CMOS , Стария  NMOS 6502 го има и БГ производство , но не ми върши работа....

И 2-та са на 1Mhz, тоест новия и по-бърз да е , пак ще е принуден да работи на 1mhz.

Ето цял Форум за тях
http://forum.6502.org/

ПП.

Ако не се намери ще си го взема от И-бея, ама да пробвам все пак...

[Pichaga933]

802, май беше с разместени крака....

[pochitatel]

802, май беше с разместени крака....

Не е, ще пасне идеално Но е ненамираем.

[Pichaga933]

Ok , ще стане , ама като го няма карай... и на C02 ще съм доволен...

[pochitatel]

E, за мен е недостъпен. Това не значи, че го няма...

[Pichaga933]

65C802 може да го замениш с масовия W65C816S


http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=W65C816S&LH_PrefLoc=2&_arm=1&_armm=63&_ruu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_from%3DR40%26_sacat%3D0%26_nkw%3DW65C816S%26_arr%3D1

Което ми дава идея...  , че ще трябва да му правиш преходник, защото краката са разместени 

http://www.datasheetarchive.com/dlmain/Datasheets-111/DSAP0032000.pdf
http://www.downloads.reactivemicro.com/Public/Electronics/CPU/65C02%20Datasheet.pdf
http://rainemu.swishparty.co.uk/html/archive/dev/w65c02s.pdf

http://archive.6502.org/datasheets/wdc_w65c816s_feb_2004.pdf

At reset, the W65C816S starts in "emulation mode," meaning it essentially behaves as a 65C02.  Following reset, the W65C816S may be switched to "native mode" with a two instruction sequence, causing it to enable all enhanced features, yet still maintain a substantial degree of backward compatibility with most 65C02 software.  However, unlike the PDIP40 version of the 65C02, which is a pin-compatible replacement for its NMOS ancestor, the PDIP40 W65C816S is not pin-compatible with any other 6502 family MPU.

Related to the W65C816S is the no-longer-produced W65C802, which is discussed below.

In the past, WDC offered a 65(C)02 PDIP40 pin-compatible variant of the W65C816S referred to as the W65C802.  The 65C802 was fully compatible with the 65C02 in all respects, but was 100 percent software compatible with the 65C816, including the use of 16–bit registers.  The W65C802 lacked the ability to generate a full 24-bit address, thus limiting it to 64 kilobytes of memory like the 65C02.  The 65C802 was produced by WDC and GTE during the mid-to-late 1980s and early 1990s.  Typically, when hardware manufacturers designed a project from the ground up, they used the 65C816 rather than the 65C802, resulting in the latter being withdrawn from production.

Прикачвам необходимото инфо за изработка на преходник, Някой да каже възможно ли е да се направи прост преходник?

С голяма резолюция Тук:
http://pics.data.bg/zoom/albums/3700da3388e790532bf3d9626eb0fc9f

6502 PRIMER: Building your own 6502 computer


What Do I Do With the "Mystery" Pins, SYNC, RDY, S.O., Φ1, MLB, BE, and VPB?

First, rest assured that for simple systems, it is not necessary to understand and use every single pin.  However, here are a few general rules for what to do with the ones whose functions don't interest you.

A pin marked "NC" in the data book means "no connection," so don't connect it.  It's not necessarily a "not-connected" pin.  A few ICs (and I don't know if that includes any 6502-family processors) have internal connections to NC pins but the pin is only used in part of the production testing.  The data sheets usually tell you.  To stay out of trouble, don't use an NC pin for things like a convenient "Y" connection in your wire-wrapping (unless you just cut the pin off the IC itself and only use the WW socket pin).

SYNC:  The "synchronize" output identifies those cycles in which the processor is fetching an op code.  It can be used with the "ready" (RDY) input to single-step the processor.  This will not be covered here, although there is the note about single-cycling the processor in the Clock Generation section.  If you don't want to further investigate this possibility through other sources, then leave this pin unconnected.

RDY:  The "ready" input is used for single-stepping, wait states for slow memory, and DMA.  On WDC's 65c02's, this has been a bidirectional pin with an internal pull-up, so you could get away without connecting it to anything; but apparently they recently removed the internal pull-up.  Better not let it float.  WDC's will pull the pin low only if it gets the WAI (wait-for-interrupt) instruction in your program.  (WAI puts the processor in a better position to make a fast-as-possible response to an imminent interrupt.)  On the other hand, although you may not have any plans to use it, a crash could make the processor misinterpret a $CB operand or data byte as the WAI op code and possibly damage the chip through heating problems if the output is shorted to +5V.  If you don't want to further investigate or use the features this pin is made for, and you want the circuit to be able to handle any manufacturer's 6502 or 65c02, pull it up to +5V through a 3.3K pull-up resistor.

Sometimes it gets called RDY (ready-not), but this is incorrect!  RDY would imply that you ground it when you're ready to have the processor move on.  It's not that way though.  You ground it when you're not ready yet and need for it to wait.  As long as the memory being accessed is always ready at the bus's clock speed, you keep RDY pulled up to mean "I'm ready and I don't need any more time to get the data out."  High means, "Yes!  Ready!  Go!"  Low means, "No, I'm not ready!  Don't go yet!"

SO (or SOB):  None of my books' authors seem to know what this set-oVerflow-flag input was intended for, and they just opt to respect its obscurity and don't use it.  It is the most mysterious of all the mystery pins!  Just connect it to +5V.  It could be seen as a 1-bit input with the fastest possible test and branch, but you would have to make sure it never goes low when you need the V bit for its intended purpose of arithmetic operations and testing bits with the BIT instruction.  You will undoubtedly have other input hardware that's more functional anyway.  The Commodore 1541 floppy-disc drive (and relatives) used it, but it was an application that would not be needing it in math routines when the V bit could get set from the outside.

Φ1: (say "phase-one")  This output is commonly left unconnected.  For computers made to the scope of this primer, probably your only reason to use it would be for the RC clock shown in the earlier section Clock Generation.  It is sometimes said to be 180 degrees out of phase with Φ2; but actually Φ2's rising and falling edges will trail Φ1's falling and rising edges (respectively) by a few nanoseconds.

MLB (or ML):  The memory-lock output is generally for multi-processor systems to keep non-optimal bus-arbitration timing from interfering with read-modify-write instructions like ASL, INC, etc..  If you don't want to further investigate this possibility through other sources, then leave this pin unconnected.  You'll only find this pin on WDC's 65c02's anyway, not on those of other manufacturers.

BE:  The bus-enable input allows external control of the buses.  If you don't want to further investigate this possibility through other sources, then pull this up to +5V through a 3.3K resistor.  You'll only find this pin on WDC's 65c02's anyway, not on those of other manufacturers.

VPB (or VP):  The vector-pull output indicates that a vector location is being addressed during an interrupt sequence.  It can be used to select and prioritize interrupts from several sources.  If you don't want to further investigate this possibility through other sources, then leave this pin unconnected.  You'll only find this pin on WDC's 65c02's anyway, not on those of other manufacturers.  Here's the minor conflict associated on the DIP (as opposed to the PLCC or QFP packages:  WDC put the VPB on pin 1 of the DIP, which is one of the two ground pins for other manufacturers.  If you want your board to be compatible with any brand of 6502/65c02, you might want to put a two-pin header to put a shorting block on to connect pin 1 to ground or not.  Unfortunately, such an arrangement will add a little more inductance to the ground connection.  There is another pin for ground (pin 21), but groundbounce and other potentially problematic behaviors on your board could be reduced with non-WDC parts if this pin were directly grounded.  If you want it simple, let me put it this way:  With WDC's 65c02, leave it unconnected.  With anyone else's, ground it.

Several pins are used for totally different functions on the 65C02 and
65816, and some of these happen to include a reversal of the signal
direction.

From a quick glance at the pinout, here are the major differences:

     65C02/65802               65816
1    Ground                    Vector Pull (output)
3    Phase 1 clock (output)    Abort (input)
5    No Connection             Memory Lock (output)
7    Sync (output)             Valid Program Address (output)
35   No Connection             Emulation status (output)
36   No Connection             Bus Enable (input)
38   Set Overflow (input)      M/X status (output)
39   Phase 2 clock (output)    Valid Data Address (output)

[pochitatel]

Най-вероятно няма да стане 65С816 само с размяна на изводите. Без много да задълбавам в проучвания съм на това мнение.

[Pichaga933]

Виж ми горното мнение...Прикачих няколко сравнителни таблици.

Доста си приличат по извводите да не кажа 99%

[pochitatel]

Казвам го по-ясно: няма да стане само с преопроводяване. 

[Pichaga933]

ок, Махнали са 5 сигнала и са сложили 5 други...

Тогава преходника няма да е толкоз прост, но не го прави чак невъзможно, след като има инфо че 816 ( горе съм цитирал) е произвеждан и в съвместим с 6502  по цокъл формат...

pin-compatible variant of the W65C816S referred to as the W65C802.

Ще се разровя в 6502 форума и ще ги питам някой правил ли е такъв преходник и дали е възможно ест...

Я тука някой е направил прехоодник

http://forum.6502.org/viewtopic.php?t=186&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

и схемка
http://sbc.rictor.org/support/conv.html

Още един адаптер,но за Commodore VIC-20,
http://www.baltissen.org/newhtm/02to816.htm

САмо Cync сигнала му липсва но от горната схема се вижда как може да се изработи.

Тестван и на Епъл 1 реплика
http://jefftranter.blogspot.co.uk/2012/06/replica-1-now-running-with-65816-cpu.html

The differences
The main differences between both processors are:

Pin     65816   6502
---   -------  --------
 1      VP      GROUND
 3      ABORT   CLK1
 5      ML      NC
 7      VPA     SYNC
35      E       NC
36      BE      NC
38      M/X     SO
39      VDA     CLK2

The 65816 lacks the CLK1 and CLK2 clock signals so we have to provide them ourselves. That's where two 74F04 inverters come in view.
ABORT and BE are 816-specific inputs and only need a pull-up resistor. These resistors enable you to use these inputs later. If you are sure you don't need them, just omit the resistors and connect these inputs directly to +5V (pin when the resistors are mentioned during the construction.
The 65816 has no SYNC or equivalent but we have to supply this output with a level and IMHO the safest level is (L). AFAIK the only system using SYNC is the KIM-1 and the Elector Junior.
The 65816 also lacks the SO-input. The only system I know using the SO-input is one of the Commodore drives: the 1541.
Схемка доста по проста:

[TheHungry]

Трябва да се поразровя и да пробвам дали 65SC02 ще работи и ще го разпознава ПроДос-а .Би трябвало да няма проблем и да е съвместим със 65C02.

[pochitatel]

65SC02 работи перфектно.

[Pichaga933]

65c02
65sc02
65c816
И 3те ги има в И-бея и са по 3$- нови  от хон конг та даже от един и същ продавач 

Мисля вече да си ги поръчам, по скоро да поръчам на еднин приятел да ги поръча...

И после да пробвам сложния преходник на растерна платка, другите елемнти са налични в комет...

[lz2xl]

Има и 65C102 на 2 мхц същия като 65C02 но с повече инструкции и по-ниска консумация.Имам някъде в мазата BBC Model B от преди 20 години точния модел    BBC Master

[Pichaga933]

Сега ако кажеш, че имаш към него и Сандъка за четене на лазерни дискове